Vaccine-Induced Tissue Scurvy Globally Misdiagnosed as Child Abuse

[Clayton]

http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/


Christina England

March 19 2014

"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

However, what if I told you that it was later proven that this child
had in fact been suffering from Kawasaki disease, otherwise known as
tissue scurvy, and that his father was innocent?

Well, that is exactly what happened. Due to the wonderful work of Dr.
Michael Innis and a team of experts brought in by the family to help,
he is well and happy and back home with his family after his father
was released from jail as an innocent man.

What Research Tells Us About Tissue Scurvy

Studies have revealed that parents and caregivers worldwide are being
falsely accused of child abuse when children develop the autoimmune
disease, tissue scurvy, after vaccination.

In a recent paper by Dr. Michael Innis, he stated that:

“Some doctors are unaware of the pathophysiological processes of
autoimmunity, haemostasis and osteogenesis and are misdiagnosing
vaccine induced tissue scurvy, absence of vitamin C within the cell,
as non-accidental injury.”

His paper, Autoimmune Tissue Scurvy Misdiagnosed as Child Abuse,
outlined three cases of children suffering from symptoms mimicking
those of shaken baby syndrome (SBS) whose parents were subsequently
accused of child abuse.

However, it was later discovered that all three parents were innocent
and far from being abused, their children had been suffering from the
autoimmune disease known as tissue scurvy."



Clayton

History of the Pharmaceutical Drug Business - from 'Murder by
Injection - The story of the Medical Conspiracy against America' by
Eustice Mullins,
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/ciencia_industryweapons13.htm

[Bob Officer]

On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England
March 19 2014
"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

Exactly.

Post by Clayton
However, what if I told you that it was later proven that this child
had in fact been suffering from Kawasaki disease, otherwise known as
tissue scurvy, and that his father was innocent?

England is wrong. Just flat out wrong. Tissue scurvy is false
disease.

[Science psycho]

Post by Bob Officer
On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England
March 19 2014
"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

Exactly.

And if you read the article the father got out of jail after it was
proved tissue scurvy was the cause.

Post by Bob Officer

Post by Clayton
However, what if I told you that it was later proven that this child
had in fact been suffering from Kawasaki disease, otherwise known as
tissue scurvy, and that his father was innocent?

England is wrong. Just flat out wrong. Tissue scurvy is false
disease.

You wouldn't know if tissue scurvy was real disease or not.
Frankly, if the cause of scurvy hadn't been so documented so long ago,
big pharma would have gotten hold of the disease and tried to cure it
with drugs.

That's what they do.
They get a disease that is really a deficiency symptom and create a
patented drug to eliminate the symptoms. Well you never see a
pharmaceutical company finding a disease that is cured by nutrients,
do you? They're just not into it, there's no profit.


Science psycho
Debunking the Placebo Effect
http://www.chiro.org/nutrition/FULL/Debunking_the_Placebo.shtml

[Bob Officer]

On Thu, 29 May 2014 00:13:39 +1000, in multiple newsgoups, Science

Post by Science psycho

Post by Bob Officer
On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England
March 19 2014
"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

Exactly.

And if you read the article the father got out of jail after it was
proved tissue scurvy was the cause.

No! Carole he got out of jail because the needed tissue was not
examined. The issue wasn't examined because some of the organs were
removed for transplant.

It has taken a while to find what I was looking for:
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-antivaccine-lie-that-just-wont-die-shaken-baby-syndrome-is-really-due-to-vaccine-injury/

Yurko got off the charges not because he was proven not guilty, but
because the body should have never been released for transplant. The
second trial judge didn't allow any mention of Yurko violent past
including use of force in hitting/abusing people.

They still have Zero explanations for the evidence of the broken ribs
or brain edema.

<cite>
It should be noted that Yurko did have grounds for a new trial, but
not because there was any credibility to the notion that SBS is a
misdiagnosis for vaccine injury. It was rather because of some very
shoddy work by the medical examiner who apparently had a history of
carelessness. The errors were not directly related to the diagnosis
of SBS but were pretty bad nonetheless. For instance, there were
typographical errors, such as referring to the child as African
American when he was Caucasian and commenting on organs that couldn’t
be there because they were donated after the baby was declared brain
dead. The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial,
after which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution.
Yurko pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time
served, six years and 125 days. It didn’t take long for Yurko to wind
up back in jail again. He was picked up for a parole violation in his
aggravated burglary charge and will be in prison until 2014.
</cite>

Note to carole: The above sentence indicate Yurko did not go free,
and certainly wasn't found innocent.
<cite>
The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial, after
which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution. Yurko
pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time served, six
years and 125 days.
</cite>

Yurko also seem to be some type of habitual criminal with some sort
of bent for inflicting harm on others.


And the best for last our very own Peter Bowditch has a well written
reports on his blog:

http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko1.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko.htm

I wonder why this published piece was removed/withdrawn? Did you ever
find out why, peter?
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/buttram.htm

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by Bob Officer
On Thu, 29 May 2014 00:13:39 +1000, in multiple newsgoups, Science

Post by Science psycho

Post by Bob Officer
On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England
March 19 2014
"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

Exactly.

And if you read the article the father got out of jail after it was
proved tissue scurvy was the cause.

No! Carole he got out of jail because the needed tissue was not
examined. The issue wasn't examined because some of the organs were
removed for transplant.
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-antivaccine-lie-that-just-wont-die-shaken-baby-syndrome-is-really-due-to-vaccine-injury/
Yurko got off the charges not because he was proven not guilty, but
because the body should have never been released for transplant. The
second trial judge didn't allow any mention of Yurko violent past
including use of force in hitting/abusing people.
They still have Zero explanations for the evidence of the broken ribs
or brain edema.
<cite>
It should be noted that Yurko did have grounds for a new trial, but
not because there was any credibility to the notion that SBS is a
misdiagnosis for vaccine injury. It was rather because of some very
shoddy work by the medical examiner who apparently had a history of
carelessness. The errors were not directly related to the diagnosis
of SBS but were pretty bad nonetheless. For instance, there were
typographical errors, such as referring to the child as African
American when he was Caucasian and commenting on organs that couldn’t
be there because they were donated after the baby was declared brain
dead. The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial,
after which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution.
Yurko pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time
served, six years and 125 days. It didn’t take long for Yurko to wind
up back in jail again. He was picked up for a parole violation in his
aggravated burglary charge and will be in prison until 2014.
</cite>
Note to carole: The above sentence indicate Yurko did not go free,
and certainly wasn't found innocent.
<cite>
The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial, after
which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution. Yurko
pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time served, six
years and 125 days.
</cite>
Yurko also seem to be some type of habitual criminal with some sort
of bent for inflicting harm on others.
And the best for last our very own Peter Bowditch has a well written
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko1.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko.htm
I wonder why this published piece was removed/withdrawn? Did you ever
find out why, peter?
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/buttram.htm

No. It just vanished. I think it might still be found on some
anti-vaccination sites, but Buttram probably eventually worked out
that his own reproduction of the autopsy findings didn't help his
case.

[Bob Officer]

On Fri, 30 May 2014 16:38:38 +1000, in misc.health.alternative, Poor

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Bob Officer
On Thu, 29 May 2014 00:13:39 +1000, in multiple newsgoups, Science

Post by Science psycho

Post by Bob Officer
On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England
March 19 2014
"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

Exactly.

And if you read the article the father got out of jail after it was
proved tissue scurvy was the cause.

No! Carole he got out of jail because the needed tissue was not
examined. The issue wasn't examined because some of the organs were
removed for transplant.
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-antivaccine-lie-that-just-wont-die-shaken-baby-syndrome-is-really-due-to-vaccine-injury/
Yurko got off the charges not because he was proven not guilty, but
because the body should have never been released for transplant. The
second trial judge didn't allow any mention of Yurko violent past
including use of force in hitting/abusing people.
They still have Zero explanations for the evidence of the broken ribs
or brain edema.
<cite>
It should be noted that Yurko did have grounds for a new trial, but
not because there was any credibility to the notion that SBS is a
misdiagnosis for vaccine injury. It was rather because of some very
shoddy work by the medical examiner who apparently had a history of
carelessness. The errors were not directly related to the diagnosis
of SBS but were pretty bad nonetheless. For instance, there were
typographical errors, such as referring to the child as African
American when he was Caucasian and commenting on organs that couldn’t
be there because they were donated after the baby was declared brain
dead. The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial,
after which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution.
Yurko pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time
served, six years and 125 days. It didn’t take long for Yurko to wind
up back in jail again. He was picked up for a parole violation in his
aggravated burglary charge and will be in prison until 2014.
</cite>
Note to carole: The above sentence indicate Yurko did not go free,
and certainly wasn't found innocent.
<cite>
The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial, after
which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution. Yurko
pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time served, six
years and 125 days.
</cite>
Yurko also seem to be some type of habitual criminal with some sort
of bent for inflicting harm on others.
And the best for last our very own Peter Bowditch has a well written
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko1.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko.htm
I wonder why this published piece was removed/withdrawn? Did you ever
find out why, peter?
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/buttram.htm

No. It just vanished. I think it might still be found on some
anti-vaccination sites, but Buttram probably eventually worked out
that his own reproduction of the autopsy findings didn't help his
case.

Makes sense, I guess.

[Enquiring minds want to know]

On Fri, 30 May 2014 16:38:38 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Bob Officer
On Thu, 29 May 2014 00:13:39 +1000, in multiple newsgoups, Science

Post by Science psycho

Post by Bob Officer
On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England
March 19 2014
"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

Exactly.

And if you read the article the father got out of jail after it was
proved tissue scurvy was the cause.

No! Carole he got out of jail because the needed tissue was not
examined. The issue wasn't examined because some of the organs were
removed for transplant.
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-antivaccine-lie-that-just-wont-die-shaken-baby-syndrome-is-really-due-to-vaccine-injury/
Yurko got off the charges not because he was proven not guilty, but
because the body should have never been released for transplant. The
second trial judge didn't allow any mention of Yurko violent past
including use of force in hitting/abusing people.
They still have Zero explanations for the evidence of the broken ribs
or brain edema.
<cite>
It should be noted that Yurko did have grounds for a new trial, but
not because there was any credibility to the notion that SBS is a
misdiagnosis for vaccine injury. It was rather because of some very
shoddy work by the medical examiner who apparently had a history of
carelessness. The errors were not directly related to the diagnosis
of SBS but were pretty bad nonetheless. For instance, there were
typographical errors, such as referring to the child as African
American when he was Caucasian and commenting on organs that couldn’t
be there because they were donated after the baby was declared brain
dead. The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial,
after which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution.
Yurko pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time
served, six years and 125 days. It didn’t take long for Yurko to wind
up back in jail again. He was picked up for a parole violation in his
aggravated burglary charge and will be in prison until 2014.
</cite>
Note to carole: The above sentence indicate Yurko did not go free,
and certainly wasn't found innocent.
<cite>
The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial, after
which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution. Yurko
pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time served, six
years and 125 days.
</cite>
Yurko also seem to be some type of habitual criminal with some sort
of bent for inflicting harm on others.
And the best for last our very own Peter Bowditch has a well written
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko1.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko.htm
I wonder why this published piece was removed/withdrawn? Did you ever
find out why, peter?
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/buttram.htm

No. It just vanished. I think it might still be found on some
anti-vaccination sites, but Buttram probably eventually worked out
that his own reproduction of the autopsy findings didn't help his
case.

Its all very well to call anybody who disagrees with mass vaccinations
for every imaginable disease on the planet, liars but how about
calling the vaccination lobby liars - why don't we call them
vaccination liars?

After all, there have been documented cases of vaccine damage, and
there are no long-term studies to compare overall health of vaccinated
against unvaccinated. Plus there is the correlation between increase
in mass vaccinations and autism which has never been explained, nor
has there every been any attempt by mainstream to come up with any
realistic reason for increase in autism, just denial, denial, denial.
So how the hell the "skeptics" can call anti-vaccers liars is beyond
rational logic.

Also we know that the pharmaceutical industry is one of the most
corrupt on the planet, whose ultimate goal is money rather than curing
anything.


Enquiring minds want to know

The pharmaceutical industry is based on myths and lies
http://www.pharmamyths.net/

Institutional Corruption of Pharmaceuticals and the Myth of Safe and
Effective Drugs
http://www.pharmamyths.net/files/JLME_ARTICLE_2013.pdf

Big Pharma Pockets $711 Billion in Profits by Price-Gouging Taxpayers
and Seniors
http://healthcareforamericanow.org/2013/04/08/pharma-711-billion-profits-price-gouging-seniors/

Pharmaceutical Companies Spent 19 Times More On Self-Promotion Than
Basic Research: Report
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/pharmaceutical-companies-marketing_n_1760380.html

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 05:57:30 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
After all, there have been documented cases of vaccine damage,

yes but (funny how there is but, those damages were they at an almost
constant rate before there were vaccines. The stats show the type of
damages we see like G-B syndrome and mDNA disorders have always been
around.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
and
there are no long-term studies to compare overall health of vaccinated
against unvaccinated.

Yes, there have been.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Plus there is the correlation between increase
in mass vaccinations and autism which has never been explained,

yes it has been explained, carole but you refuse to understand. As
the number of criteria increased over the years, the number of people
which are included increased in proportion.

Do not forget this next year we well see a decrease in ASD equally to
the rate of increase when Asperger's Syndrome was added to the ASD
numbers. Each change of criteria in diagnosis with make proportional
changes in the numbers of people with ASD.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
nor
has there every been any attempt by mainstream to come up with any
realistic reason for increase in autism, just denial, denial, denial.
So how the hell the "skeptics" can call anti-vaccers liars is beyond
rational logic.

The logic and meaning of the number seem to escape you, doesn't it
carole. do you understand ASD doesn't have an objective test. It is
subjective, and done by observation of behavior. Each criteria gets a
"score". IF a person scores enough of the criteria that are diagnosed
as have ASD. IIRC the prior diagnosis was a score of 9 out of 15
different listed actions and responses during a set time limit of
observation.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Also we know that the pharmaceutical industry is one of the most
corrupt on the planet, whose ultimate goal is money rather than curing
anything.

You have that belief... but like all beliefs are based on dogma and
not facts.


You might want to delimitate your signature carole, you are spamming
WEb URLs

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Enquiring minds want to know

is that the silliest thing you could call yourself carole?.

[Enquiring minds want to know]

Post by Bob Officer
On Sat, 31 May 2014 05:57:30 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
After all, there have been documented cases of vaccine damage,

yes but (funny how there is but, those damages were they at an almost
constant rate before there were vaccines. The stats show the type of
damages we see like G-B syndrome and mDNA disorders have always been
around.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
and
there are no long-term studies to compare overall health of vaccinated
against unvaccinated.

Yes, there have been.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Plus there is the correlation between increase
in mass vaccinations and autism which has never been explained,

yes it has been explained, carole but you refuse to understand. As
the number of criteria increased over the years, the number of people
which are included increased in proportion.

No, it hasn't been explained fred.
What used to be a rate condition is now affecting up to 1 in 60.

And its no use quoting articles written by David Gorski / Orac because
apparently he has conflict of interest, Fred.

David Gorski’s Financial Pharma Ties: What He Didn’t Tell You
http://www.ageofautism.com/2010/06/david-gorskis-financial-pharma-ties-what-he-didnt-tell-you.html

Post by Bob Officer
Do not forget this next year we well see a decrease in ASD equally to
the rate of increase when Asperger's Syndrome was added to the ASD
numbers. Each change of criteria in diagnosis with make proportional
changes in the numbers of people with ASD.

Try convincing all those parents who's children were fine before
vaccination, then changed afterwards. And there do seem to be some
compelling stories, Fred.

Post by Bob Officer

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
nor
has there every been any attempt by mainstream to come up with any
realistic reason for increase in autism, just denial, denial, denial.
So how the hell the "skeptics" can call anti-vaccers liars is beyond
rational logic.

The logic and meaning of the number seem to escape you, doesn't it
carole. do you understand ASD doesn't have an objective test. It is
subjective, and done by observation of behavior. Each criteria gets a
"score". IF a person scores enough of the criteria that are diagnosed
as have ASD. IIRC the prior diagnosis was a score of 9 out of 15
different listed actions and responses during a set time limit of
observation.

I know there is a lot of spin and hype designed to detract from the
apparently increase in incidence.
And the pharmaceutical companies Fred, will deny, deny, deny there is
any connection between autism and vaccines.
If you can't beat them with science, beat them with bullshit.

Post by Bob Officer

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Also we know that the pharmaceutical industry is one of the most
corrupt on the planet, whose ultimate goal is money rather than curing
anything.

You have that belief... but like all beliefs are based on dogma and
not facts.

YOu have your beliefs Fred, in that you think that modern science is
wonderful despite the fact that the cost of prohibitive for so many,
and that there is so much chronic ill health around.

Post by Bob Officer
You might want to delimitate your signature carole, you are spamming
WEb URLs

You might want to consider getting some help with your mental
processes Fred as your circular thinking is beginning to run in
smaller and smaller circcles.

When you ask yourself a question Fred, you should always consider if
it addresses the commsense issues, rather than the spin issues that
serve corporate business.

Post by Bob Officer

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Enquiring minds want to know

is that the silliest thing you could call yourself carole?.

I wound't know fred, you seem to be the one with the issues.

You should consider Fred whether your continuous quoting of things
"carole" has said, are suitable quotes to go under your sig and
whether they might in fact be breaching the delimiters allowed for
allowable repetition according to the BM (bloody moron?) index.


Enquiring minds want to know

The pharmaceutical industry is based on myths and lies
http://www.pharmamyths.net/

Institutional Corruption of Pharmaceuticals and the Myth of Safe and
Effective Drugs
http://www.pharmamyths.net/files/JLME_ARTICLE_2013.pdf

Big Pharma Pockets $711 Billion in Profits by Price-Gouging Taxpayers
and Seniors
http://healthcareforamericanow.org/2013/04/08/pharma-711-billion-profits-price-gouging-seniors/

Pharmaceutical Companies Spent 19 Times More On Self-Promotion Than
Basic Research: Report
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/pharmaceutical-companies-marketing_n_1760380.html

[Fred]

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
And its no use quoting articles written by David Gorski / Orac
because apparently he has conflict of interest, Fred.
David Gorski’s Financial Pharma Ties: What He Didn’t Tell You
http://www.ageofautism.com/2010/06/david-gorskis-financial-pharma-ties-what-he-didnt-tell-you.html

The amount of funding Dr. Gorski receives from any medical or
pharmaceutical company is zero.

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/in-which-i-am-once-again-in-the-crosshairs-of-age-of-autisms-pharma-shill-machine-gun/

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/editorial-staff/david-h-gorski-md-phd-managing-editor/
--
"You have to remember Michele I don't take any
pharmaceutical products at all except for the
occasional panadeine for the odd hangover."
- carole hubbard on 3 Jun 2004
Message-ID: <***@posting.google.com>

http://gsk.co.nz/panadeine.html


"I do binge a little here and there - so what?"
- carole hubbard on 30 Jun 2004
Message-ID: <***@posting.google.com>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binge_drinking


"A drink or two doesn't give one a hangover. Lose count?
Are you a drunk who tries to minimize their binge drinking?
Alcoholics often defend their drinking, Carole. Hangovers
don't happen after a drink or two. Drinking to the point
of getting a hangover is binge drinking. Occasionally
binging is binging. Understand that?"
- Michelle replying to carole on 1 Jul 2004
Message-ID: <***@posting.google.com>

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/binging

http://www.drinkwise.org.au/you-alcohol/alcohol-facts/binge-drinking/


“Haven't drunk in years. It was a social thing when I was
working away from home, thought it was fun at the time,
sort of like in holiday mode. The result of being brought
up in an overly straight environment where my parents drank
1 bottle of beer between themselves at xmas every 2nd year.
Things change. I don't drink anymore because I don't like
hangovers.” – carole hubbard on 27 Apr 2014
Message-ID: ***@4ax.com


”I gave up smoking using my own willpower and gave up
drinking by substituting with soft drink, which I have
now downscaled to about 1 750ml bottle a week mixed
with soda water - 1/4 lemon squash 3/4 soda water.
I had a drink at a xmas party xmas before last.
As I said, occasionally I indulge, or if I go
to visit somebody who drinks.”
– carole hubbard on 27 Apr 2014
Message-ID: ***@4ax.com


"I gave it [drinking] up about 5 or 6 years ago. Maybe
occasional glass of something if I go out."
- carole hubbard on 28 Apr 2014
Message-ID: <***@4ax.com>


“I wouldn't take pharmaceutical drugs for anything.”
– carole hubbard on 30 Apr 2014
Message-ID: ***@4ax.com

“I don't take drugs for anything, except the occasional
paracetamol less and less frequently.”
– carole hubbard on 30 Apr 2014
Message-ID: ***@4ax.com


“Drinking alcohol is not illegal. But apart from that,
I gave up shortly after 2006. And why shouldn't I drink,
I'm an adult ie over 21.”
– carole hubbard on 17 May 2014
Message-ID: ***@4ax.com


"I had a couple of midori and lemonade the other day -
should have stopped at one though."
- carole hubbard on 12/15/2011
Message-ID: <od5Gq.301$%***@viwinnwfe01.internal.bigpond.com>

http://www.midori.com.au/


http://www.drinkwise.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/Effects-of-alcohol-DrinkWise.pdf


http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/_files_nhmrc/publications/attachments/ds10-alcohol.pdf


http://www.alcohol.gov.au/internet/alcohol/publishing.nsf/Content/36E6FEE732C8DF1BCA25767200769CD8/$File/adult.pdf


http://www.alcohol.gov.au/internet/alcohol/publishing.nsf/Content/E9E12B0E00E94FD5CA25718E0081F1DC/$File/std0910.pdf

http://www.mayoclinic.org/healthy-living/adult-health/in-depth/denial/art-20047926


http://www.anosvic.org.au/ANOS_Vic_Contacts.html

http://bitsy.spinics.net/849

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 11:54:06 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

Post by Bob Officer
On Sat, 31 May 2014 05:57:30 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
After all, there have been documented cases of vaccine damage,

yes but (funny how there is but, those damages were they at an almost
constant rate before there were vaccines. The stats show the type of
damages we see like G-B syndrome and mDNA disorders have always been
around.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
and
there are no long-term studies to compare overall health of vaccinated
against unvaccinated.

Yes, there have been.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Plus there is the correlation between increase
in mass vaccinations and autism which has never been explained,

yes it has been explained, carole but you refuse to understand. As
the number of criteria increased over the years, the number of people
which are included increased in proportion.

No, it hasn't been explained fred.

yes it has. other the year the number of criteria allowed in a the
diagnosis has increased. Each time the criteria changed there was a
remark increase in diagnosis.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
What used to be a rate condition is now affecting up to 1 in 60.

Ok I will try one last time, carole.

It is year x+0
You have a list of 11 criteria.
and you will check 1000 people.
You check for Criteria #1. and find 12 people have it.
You check for Criteria #2. and find 3 people have it.
You check for criteria #3. and find 2 people have it.
You check for criteria #4. and find 2 people have it.
You check for Criteria #5. and find 3 people have it.
You check for Criteria #6. and find 5 people have it.
You check for Criteria #7. and find 6 people have it.
You check for Criteria #8. and find 1 people have it.
You check for Criteria #9. and find 5 people have it.
You check for Criteria #10. and find 8 people have it.
You check for Criteria #11. and find 6 people have it.

Now each person will need have 5 out of the 11 criteria to be
diagnosed with the QYP Spectrum Disorder

Now it is year x+10 years.
You now have a check list of 15 criteria
you will check the same 1000 people.
You check for Criteria #1. and find 12 people have it.
You check for Criteria #2. and find 3 people have it.
You check for criteria #3. and find 2 people have it.
You check for criteria #4. and find 2 people have it.
You check for Criteria #5. and find 3 people have it.
You check for Criteria #6. and find 5 people have it.
You check for Criteria #7. and find 6 people have it.
You check for Criteria #8. and find 1 people have it.
You check for Criteria #9. and find 5 people have it.
You check for Criteria #10. and find 8 people have it.
You check for Criteria #11. and find 6 people have it.
You check for Criteria #12. and find 7 people have it.
You check for Criteria #13. and find 15 people have it.
You check for Criteria #14. and find 4 people have it.
You check for Criteria #15. and find 9 people have it.

Each person will need to 7 out of the 15 criteria to be diagnosed
with QYP syndrome.

As the number of criteria increases the odds of a single person being
diagnosed increases.

AS you read you will see the number of people meeting any single
criteria will remain steady. This is the same with ASD.

Now this year people with Asperger's syndrome will not be included in
the ASD diagnosis. The number of people reported with ASD is already
dropping, because the number of criteria allowed into the diagnostic
list has decrease.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
And its no use quoting articles written by David Gorski / Orac because
apparently he has conflict of interest, Fred.
David Gorski’s Financial Pharma Ties: What He Didn’t Tell You
http://www.ageofautism.com/2010/06/david-gorskis-financial-pharma-ties-what-he-didnt-tell-you.html

coming from a group which stood behind wakefield and still does even
after his outright COI was exposed is a yawner.

then Crosby's use of lies is evidence...
<cite>
"millionaire vaccine industrialist Paul Offit
</cite>
While Offit's vaccine license was sold for a large sum. he kept very
little of it, but distributed the funds to the people that worked
upon the vaccine project.

The shallow attempt to spin Offit as an evil person because he earned
profit from a multi year project is just a form of a ad hominem
attack.

It is plain Crosby doesn't understand what conflict of interest
means, the same as carole doesn't understand what the word
suppression means.

Cosby makes lots of suppositions and opinions but has very little to
back them.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

Post by Bob Officer
Do not forget this next year we well see a decrease in ASD equally to
the rate of increase when Asperger's Syndrome was added to the ASD
numbers. Each change of criteria in diagnosis with make proportional
changes in the numbers of people with ASD.

Try convincing all those parents who's children were fine before
vaccination, then changed afterwards. And there do seem to be some
compelling stories, Fred.

But to understand there was always a number of children with the
criteria used in the diagnosis of the conditions means one can not
blame vaccines for the development of the conditions.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

Post by Bob Officer

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
nor
has there every been any attempt by mainstream to come up with any
realistic reason for increase in autism, just denial, denial, denial.
So how the hell the "skeptics" can call anti-vaccers liars is beyond
rational logic.

The logic and meaning of the number seem to escape you, doesn't it
carole. do you understand ASD doesn't have an objective test. It is
subjective, and done by observation of behavior. Each criteria gets a
"score". IF a person scores enough of the criteria that are diagnosed
as have ASD. IIRC the prior diagnosis was a score of 9 out of 15
different listed actions and responses during a set time limit of
observation.

I know there is a lot of spin and hype designed to detract from the
apparently increase in incidence.

That's the problem, carole, the apparent increase is strictly
apparent, an artifact of the increasing number of included criteria
in the ASD diagnosis.


<Snip of worthless and unsupported banter>

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Its all very well to call anybody who disagrees with mass vaccinations
for every imaginable disease on the planet, liars but how about
calling the vaccination lobby liars - why don't we call them
vaccination liars?

Because they tell the truth.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
After all, there have been documented cases of vaccine damage,

A fact which nobody denies.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
and
there are no long-term studies to compare overall health of vaccinated
against unvaccinated.

How many of these non-existent studies would you like?

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Plus there is the correlation between increase
in mass vaccinations and autism which has never been explained,

It has been explained many times. There is also a correlation between
the rate of autism and increases in the use of mobile phones and the
World Wide Web, mentions of a Kardashian anywhere in the media, the
price of Sydney real estate, and the number of cars made by Hyundai.

It's one of those DDT things - definition, diagnosis, triage.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
nor
has there every been any attempt by mainstream to come up with any
realistic reason for increase in autism, just denial, denial, denial.

The apparent increase has several realistic explanations. The fact
that you neither understand nor accept them is irrelevant to the
truth.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
So how the hell the "skeptics" can call anti-vaccers liars is beyond
rational logic.

The tell lies. It's that simple.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Also we know that the pharmaceutical industry is one of the most
corrupt on the planet, whose ultimate goal is money rather than curing
anything.

All businesses are out to make money.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Enquiring minds want to know

It's a pity that you don't have one then, isn't it Carole?

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:27:43 +1000, in misc.health.alternative, Poor

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Its all very well to call anybody who disagrees with mass vaccinations
for every imaginable disease on the planet, liars but how about
calling the vaccination lobby liars - why don't we call them
vaccination liars?

Because they tell the truth.

and the call isn't for "mass vaccinations for every imaginable
disease on the planet" either. There is interest for diseases which
cause death and great bodily harm, and which are easily spread or
highly infectious.

Diseases like Tetanus, Diphtheria, Pertussis, Measles, Polio and
Rubella are generally considered highly worthy of mass vaccination. I
might have missed a few in my haste.

Carole forgets one of the diseases not in that list. Smallpox has
been eliminated completely. A major cattle disease, renderpest, was
eliminated and no long exists. Both of these diseases had only host.

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
After all, there have been documented cases of vaccine damage,

A fact which nobody denies.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
and
there are no long-term studies to compare overall health of vaccinated
against unvaccinated.

How many of these non-existent studies would you like?

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Plus there is the correlation between increase
in mass vaccinations and autism which has never been explained,

It has been explained many times. There is also a correlation between
the rate of autism and increases in the use of mobile phones and the
World Wide Web, mentions of a Kardashian anywhere in the media, the
price of Sydney real estate, and the number of cars made by Hyundai.
It's one of those DDT things - definition, diagnosis, triage.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
nor
has there every been any attempt by mainstream to come up with any
realistic reason for increase in autism, just denial, denial, denial.

The apparent increase has several realistic explanations. The fact
that you neither understand nor accept them is irrelevant to the
truth.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
So how the hell the "skeptics" can call anti-vaccers liars is beyond
rational logic.

The tell lies. It's that simple.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Also we know that the pharmaceutical industry is one of the most
corrupt on the planet, whose ultimate goal is money rather than curing
anything.

All businesses are out to make money.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Enquiring minds want to know

It's a pity that you don't have one then, isn't it Carole?

a real pity.

Does she realize the people in sci.skeptic are laughing at her and
her socks?

[Enquiring minds want to know]

Post by Bob Officer
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:27:43 +1000, in misc.health.alternative, Poor

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Its all very well to call anybody who disagrees with mass vaccinations
for every imaginable disease on the planet, liars but how about
calling the vaccination lobby liars - why don't we call them
vaccination liars?

Because they tell the truth.

and the call isn't for "mass vaccinations for every imaginable
disease on the planet" either. There is interest for diseases which
cause death and great bodily harm, and which are easily spread or
highly infectious.

Just another new disease that needs vaccinating against every year or
so. Measles is harmless in the west, so you lie.

Post by Bob Officer
Diseases like Tetanus, Diphtheria, Pertussis, Measles, Polio and
Rubella are generally considered highly worthy of mass vaccination. I
might have missed a few in my haste.
Carole forgets one of the diseases not in that list. Smallpox has
been eliminated completely. A major cattle disease, renderpest, was
eliminated and no long exists. Both of these diseases had only host.

No Fred, smallpox was on the decline well BEFORE mass vaccination
began. You really do fall for the propaganda EVERY TIME.

Smallpox Eradication – One of History’s Biggest Lies & How Vaccination
Did Not Eradicate Smallpox
http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/2013/12/23/smallpox-eradication-one-of-historys-biggest-lies-how-vaccination-did-not-eradicate-smallpox/

Post by Bob Officer

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Enquiring minds want to know

It's a pity that you don't have one then, isn't it Carole?

a real pity.
Does she realize the people in sci.skeptic are laughing at her and
her socks?

That is your opinion Fred.
And remember that everybody is entitled to their opinion, but that's
all it is - an opinion.

And don't you think you've passed your bullshit indiex allowable under
usenet rules, for the month, Fred?



Enquiring minds want to know

The pharmaceutical industry is based on myths and lies
http://www.pharmamyths.net/

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 12:39:56 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

Post by Bob Officer
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:27:43 +1000, in misc.health.alternative, Poor

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Its all very well to call anybody who disagrees with mass vaccinations
for every imaginable disease on the planet, liars but how about
calling the vaccination lobby liars - why don't we call them
vaccination liars?

Because they tell the truth.

and the call isn't for "mass vaccinations for every imaginable
disease on the planet" either. There is interest for diseases which
cause death and great bodily harm, and which are easily spread or
highly infectious.

Just another new disease that needs vaccinating against every year or
so. Measles is harmless in the west, so you lie.

How do you explain the number of people that DIED last year in NEW
YORK CITY from measles? That doesn't sound harmless does it?

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

Post by Bob Officer
Diseases like Tetanus, Diphtheria, Pertussis, Measles, Polio and
Rubella are generally considered highly worthy of mass vaccination. I
might have missed a few in my haste.
Carole forgets one of the diseases not in that list. Smallpox has
been eliminated completely. A major cattle disease, renderpest, was
eliminated and no long exists. Both of these diseases had only host.

No Fred, smallpox was on the decline well BEFORE mass vaccination
began. You really do fall for the propaganda EVERY TIME.

It was in decline because of very strict rules on quarantine during
travel. And for no other reason.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

Post by Bob Officer

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Enquiring minds want to know

It's a pity that you don't have one then, isn't it Carole?

a real pity.
Does she realize the people in sci.skeptic are laughing at her and
her socks?

That is your opinion Fred.

And it backed by their statements, carole.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
And remember that everybody is entitled to their opinion, but that's
all it is - an opinion.

I have started to feel everyone may be entitled to their opinions,
but the right to express it should be limited. Especially when it
come to willfully ignorant people like you.

[george152]

Smallpox Eradication – One of History’s Biggest Lies & How Vaccination
Did Not Eradicate Smallpox
http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/2013/12/23/smallpox-eradication-one-of-historys-biggest-lies-how-vaccination-did-not-eradicate-smallpox/

Antivaccine propaganda and wrong...

[Bob Casanova]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 16:32:08 +1200, the following appeared

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Smallpox Eradication – One of History’s Biggest Lies & How Vaccination
Did Not Eradicate Smallpox
http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/2013/12/23/smallpox-eradication-one-of-historys-biggest-lies-how-vaccination-did-not-eradicate-smallpox/

An interesting compendium of self-contradictory "statistics"
based on half-truths and "lies by omission". And no mention
of the fact that the only smallpox vector is human, making
comparison between Leicester and overcrowded London a bit of
an "apples/oranges" issue.

Post by george152
Antivaccine propaganda and wrong...

"Wrong" falls far short of the mark.

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 10:12:18 -0700, in misc.health.alternative, Bob

Post by Bob Casanova
On Sat, 31 May 2014 16:32:08 +1200, the following appeared

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Smallpox Eradication – One of History’s Biggest Lies & How Vaccination
Did Not Eradicate Smallpox
http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/2013/12/23/smallpox-eradication-one-of-historys-biggest-lies-how-vaccination-did-not-eradicate-smallpox/

An interesting compendium of self-contradictory "statistics"
based on half-truths and "lies by omission". And no mention
of the fact that the only smallpox vector is human, making
comparison between Leicester and overcrowded London a bit of
an "apples/oranges" issue.

This same point is illustrated with the Renderpest vaccine. A
combination of Vaccine and active quarantines helped eradicate the
disease. Renderpest like Smallpox had one and only one vector.

Influenza one the other hand has three vectors and can "resort" it
self in two of the three vectors.

Tetanus (c. Tetani) one the other hand is a soil born disease, and is
very pervasive in the environment. A vaccine is the best control we
can have. The effect of the disease is disabling, and even with
prompt treatment it can cause non-repairable damages.

Wait until you read carole's claim that measles is harmless
infection.

Post by Bob Casanova

Post by george152
Antivaccine propaganda and wrong...

"Wrong" falls far short of the mark.

Wrong is just the starting place. Several invectives can be added as
needed. The anti-vax movement must really hate children.

[The Sock]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:27:43 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Its all very well to call anybody who disagrees with mass vaccinations
for every imaginable disease on the planet, liars but how about
calling the vaccination lobby liars - why don't we call them
vaccination liars?

Because they tell the truth.

You mean in your opinion.
So the pro-vaccers could be called liars in that they promote mass
vaccination without knowing why there is a correlation between rise in
vaccine incidence and increase in autism numbers.

Apparently it is a pandemic and nothing is being done to investigate -
just denial, denial, denial from big pharma cronies.

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
After all, there have been documented cases of vaccine damage,

A fact which nobody denies.

So explain why there can be vaccine damage, yet vaccines are perfectly
safe.

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
and
there are no long-term studies to compare overall health of vaccinated
against unvaccinated.

How many of these non-existent studies would you like?

Western studies, done in a western environment under the usual western
conditions comparing those who have had all the vaccinations and those
who haven't.

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Plus there is the correlation between increase
in mass vaccinations and autism which has never been explained,

It has been explained many times. There is also a correlation between
the rate of autism and increases in the use of mobile phones and the
World Wide Web, mentions of a Kardashian anywhere in the media, the
price of Sydney real estate, and the number of cars made by Hyundai.

It becomes obvious that there is no explanation for increase in
autism, despite the parents who say it began after vaccinations.
Excuse me for commenting that explanations are no good if they don't
address the issues adequately.

If there really were explanations, there would be cures.
To say that increase in autism isn't caused by vaccines is not an
explanation. If the science is any good they should be able to pin
point the causes. To merely deny this or that is the cause is no
explanation for the increase.

Western medicine is supposed to be the best there is, cutting edge and
all the rest, yet what good is it if it can't explain and autism
pandemic and come up with a cure?

Useless as tits on a bull.

Make sense?

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch
It's one of those DDT things - definition, diagnosis, triage.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
nor
has there every been any attempt by mainstream to come up with any
realistic reason for increase in autism, just denial, denial, denial.

The apparent increase has several realistic explanations. The fact
that you neither understand nor accept them is irrelevant to the
truth.

But do these explanations pass the commonsense test?
Or are they convoluted in that only somebody with a medical degree can
follow?

And if there are explanations there should be cures, right?
What, no cures?

Back to the drawing board, methinks Randell !

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
So how the hell the "skeptics" can call anti-vaccers liars is beyond
rational logic.

The tell lies. It's that simple.

But the anti-vaccers say the pro-vaccers are liars and under the
control of big pharma - take Orac the nipple ripper for example. Seems
that the guy is getting money indirectly from big pharma so that makes
it ok, right?

David Gorski’s Financial Pharma Ties: What He Didn’t Tell You
http://www.ageofautism.com/2010/06/david-gorskis-financial-pharma-ties-what-he-didnt-tell-you.html

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Also we know that the pharmaceutical industry is one of the most
corrupt on the planet, whose ultimate goal is money rather than curing
anything.

All businesses are out to make money.

And the war business is out to make money, and guess what, the US
department of defence can't account for trillions.

Government, Military Corruption
Trillions Missing at Defense Department
http://www.WantToKnow.info/corruptiongovernmentmilitary

But I guess that's ok, as long as they're fighting terrorism, or
whatever they do, who cares about the money, right?




The Sock
Tune in for another gripping episode where we get all deep and
meaningful about absolutely nothing

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by The Sock
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:27:43 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Its all very well to call anybody who disagrees with mass vaccinations
for every imaginable disease on the planet, liars but how about
calling the vaccination lobby liars - why don't we call them
vaccination liars?

Because they tell the truth.

You mean in your opinion.

No, based on objective examination of the facts,

Post by The Sock
So the pro-vaccers could be called liars in that they promote mass
vaccination without knowing why there is a correlation between rise in
vaccine incidence and increase in autism numbers.

See, there is a lie right there. The reasons for the "correlation
between rise in vaccine incidence and increase in autism numbers" are
well known and understood.

Post by The Sock
Apparently it is a pandemic and nothing is being done to investigate -
just denial, denial, denial from big pharma cronies.

It is not a pandemic. Please try to use words correctly. There are
26,512 papers found by a search of PubMed for the word "autism", which
is a long way from "nothing is being done to investigate". You might
even call that another lie.

Post by The Sock

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
After all, there have been documented cases of vaccine damage,

A fact which nobody denies.

So explain why there can be vaccine damage, yet vaccines are perfectly
safe.

Nobody has ever said that "vaccines are perfectly safe" except
anti-vaccination liars lying about what sane people say.

Post by The Sock

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
and
there are no long-term studies to compare overall health of vaccinated
against unvaccinated.

How many of these non-existent studies would you like?

Western studies, done in a western environment under the usual western
conditions comparing those who have had all the vaccinations and those
who haven't.

How many of these non-existent studies would you like?

Post by The Sock

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Plus there is the correlation between increase
in mass vaccinations and autism which has never been explained,

It has been explained many times. There is also a correlation between
the rate of autism and increases in the use of mobile phones and the
World Wide Web, mentions of a Kardashian anywhere in the media, the
price of Sydney real estate, and the number of cars made by Hyundai.

It becomes obvious that there is no explanation for increase in
autism, despite the parents who say it began after vaccinations.
Excuse me for commenting that explanations are no good if they don't
address the issues adequately.

So when provided with an explanation you say "there is no
explanation". Thank you for admitting that nothing will correct your
misapprehensions of reality.

Post by The Sock
If there really were explanations, there would be cures.

Why?

Post by The Sock
To say that increase in autism isn't caused by vaccines is not an
explanation. If the science is any good they should be able to pin
point the causes. To merely deny this or that is the cause is no
explanation for the increase.

The causes are genetic.

Post by The Sock
Western medicine is supposed to be the best there is, cutting edge and
all the rest, yet what good is it if it can't explain and autism
pandemic and come up with a cure?

There is no pandemic, and much work is being done to manage autism
(not "cure", because that is impossible).

Post by The Sock
Useless as tits on a bull.
Make sense?

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch
It's one of those DDT things - definition, diagnosis, triage.

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
nor
has there every been any attempt by mainstream to come up with any
realistic reason for increase in autism, just denial, denial, denial.

The apparent increase has several realistic explanations. The fact
that you neither understand nor accept them is irrelevant to the
truth.

But do these explanations pass the commonsense test?

Yes.

Post by The Sock
Or are they convoluted in that only somebody with a medical degree can
follow?

I have no medical degree and I can understand them.

Post by The Sock
And if there are explanations there should be cures, right?

No. Some things can't be cured, only treated.

Post by The Sock
What, no cures?
Back to the drawing board, methinks Randell !

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
So how the hell the "skeptics" can call anti-vaccers liars is beyond
rational logic.

The tell lies. It's that simple.

But the anti-vaccers say the pro-vaccers are liars and under the
control of big pharma - take Orac the nipple ripper for example. Seems
that the guy is getting money indirectly from big pharma so that makes
it ok, right?

Please don't quote Tim Bolen's kindergarten insults.

Post by The Sock
David Gorski’s Financial Pharma Ties: What He Didn’t Tell You
http://www.ageofautism.com/2010/06/david-gorskis-financial-pharma-ties-what-he-didnt-tell-you.html

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Also we know that the pharmaceutical industry is one of the most
corrupt on the planet, whose ultimate goal is money rather than curing
anything.

All businesses are out to make money.

And the war business is out to make money, and guess what, the US
department of defence can't account for trillions.

Which has what to do with anything here?

Post by The Sock
Government, Military Corruption
Trillions Missing at Defense Department
http://www.WantToKnow.info/corruptiongovernmentmilitary
But I guess that's ok, as long as they're fighting terrorism, or
whatever they do, who cares about the money, right?
The Sock
Tune in for another gripping episode where we get all deep and
meaningful about absolutely nothing

[Clayton]

On Thu, 29 May 2014 18:04:48 -0700, Bob Officer

Post by Bob Officer
On Thu, 29 May 2014 00:13:39 +1000, in multiple newsgoups, Science

Post by Science psycho

Post by Bob Officer
On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England
March 19 2014
"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

Exactly.

And if you read the article the father got out of jail after it was
proved tissue scurvy was the cause.

No! Carole he got out of jail because the needed tissue was not
examined. The issue wasn't examined because some of the organs were
removed for transplant.

Well fred, I don't see how you can say that because the article
doesn't mention the name of the child or the father, just the fact of
misdiagnosis of SBS.

Post by Bob Officer
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-antivaccine-lie-that-just-wont-die-shaken-baby-syndrome-is-really-due-to-vaccine-injury/
Yurko got off the charges not because he was proven not guilty, but
because the body should have never been released for transplant. The
second trial judge didn't allow any mention of Yurko violent past
including use of force in hitting/abusing people.

You give one case which may be the exception.
The article mentions that there are other cases where there has been
misdiagnosis.

I don't consider David Gorski a person of integrity as he is closely
tied to the dubious skeptic movement.

Post by Bob Officer
They still have Zero explanations for the evidence of the broken ribs
or brain edema.
<cite>
It should be noted that Yurko did have grounds for a new trial, but
not because there was any credibility to the notion that SBS is a
misdiagnosis for vaccine injury. It was rather because of some very
shoddy work by the medical examiner who apparently had a history of
carelessness. The errors were not directly related to the diagnosis
of SBS but were pretty bad nonetheless. For instance, there were
typographical errors, such as referring to the child as African
American when he was Caucasian and commenting on organs that couldn’t
be there because they were donated after the baby was declared brain
dead. The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial,
after which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution.
Yurko pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time
served, six years and 125 days. It didn’t take long for Yurko to wind
up back in jail again. He was picked up for a parole violation in his
aggravated burglary charge and will be in prison until 2014.
</cite>
Note to carole: The above sentence indicate Yurko did not go free,
and certainly wasn't found innocent.
<cite>

No use putting "note to carole" fred.

Post by Bob Officer
The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial, after
which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution. Yurko
pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time served, six
years and 125 days.
</cite>
Yurko also seem to be some type of habitual criminal with some sort
of bent for inflicting harm on others.
And the best for last our very own Peter Bowditch has a well written
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko1.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko.htm
I wonder why this published piece was removed/withdrawn? Did you ever
find out why, peter?
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/buttram.htm

Your very own Peter Bowditch.
He is not an altie but goes out of his way to dismiss alternative and
back big pharma.

IOW Bowditch will go for mainstream explanations every time.


Clayton

The Truth Troll
" ... the perverted citation system has become the refuge of academic
assassins and truth trolls who use the system to concoct ridiculous
and illogical arguments that nonetheless are accepted as "truth"
because they are reliably referenced."
http://one-evil.org/content/about.html

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 05:50:52 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
On Thu, 29 May 2014 18:04:48 -0700, Bob Officer

Post by Bob Officer
On Thu, 29 May 2014 00:13:39 +1000, in multiple newsgoups, Science

Post by Science psycho

Post by Bob Officer
On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England
March 19 2014
"The father of the child in our published photo was jailed for life
for child abuse. Many of you looking at the terrible injuries on this
small child will immediately assume, as did the doctors who examined
him, that he was viciously attacked and it was right to jail his
father.

Exactly.

And if you read the article the father got out of jail after it was
proved tissue scurvy was the cause.

No! Carole he got out of jail because the needed tissue was not
examined. The issue wasn't examined because some of the organs were
removed for transplant.

Well fred, I don't see how you can say that because the article
doesn't mention the name of the child or the father, just the fact of
misdiagnosis of SBS.

I did some extra reading. You should try it sometime.

The cases wasn't misdiagnosed at all. That was an attempt to spin by
antivaxers, of which Innis is one. The FACT is the person the article
is about, Yurko, Did Plead GUILTY to injuring the child. Sure it was
a lesser charge, but it was his ticket out of the prison. Since the
case took place in Florida, The case could have come out with a
harsher sentence (it was originally a death penalty case) than Life
in prison without parole. Since then Yurko was again arrested for a
violent crime and is back in prison. Yurko has a history of violence
to others. Hint it is called criminal background.

Post by Clayton

Post by Bob Officer
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-antivaccine-lie-that-just-wont-die-shaken-baby-syndrome-is-really-due-to-vaccine-injury/
Yurko got off the charges not because he was proven not guilty, but
because the body should have never been released for transplant. The
second trial judge didn't allow any mention of Yurko violent past
including use of force in hitting/abusing people.

You give one case which may be the exception.
The article mentions that there are other cases where there has been
misdiagnosis.

And they have been still found guilty. There wasn't the missing
tissue samples to muddy the waters in those cases.

Post by Clayton
I don't consider David Gorski a person of integrity as he is closely
tied to the dubious skeptic movement.

I consider his analysis very exact and since he used facts and data,
not spin, suppositions and plays upon people's emotions.

Post by Clayton

Post by Bob Officer
They still have Zero explanations for the evidence of the broken ribs
or brain edema.
<cite>
It should be noted that Yurko did have grounds for a new trial, but
not because there was any credibility to the notion that SBS is a
misdiagnosis for vaccine injury. It was rather because of some very
shoddy work by the medical examiner who apparently had a history of
carelessness. The errors were not directly related to the diagnosis
of SBS but were pretty bad nonetheless. For instance, there were
typographical errors, such as referring to the child as African
American when he was Caucasian and commenting on organs that couldn’t
be there because they were donated after the baby was declared brain
dead. The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial,
after which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution.
Yurko pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time
served, six years and 125 days. It didn’t take long for Yurko to wind
up back in jail again. He was picked up for a parole violation in his
aggravated burglary charge and will be in prison until 2014.
</cite>
Note to carole: The above sentence indicate Yurko did not go free,
and certainly wasn't found innocent.
<cite>

No use putting "note to carole" fred.

Your right carole doesn't read and understand what she has read.

Post by Clayton

Post by Bob Officer
The judge ruled that these screwups warranted a new trial, after
which Yurko’s defense team reached a deal with the prosecution. Yurko
pled no contest to manslaughter and was sentenced to time served, six
years and 125 days.
</cite>
Yurko also seem to be some type of habitual criminal with some sort
of bent for inflicting harm on others.
And the best for last our very own Peter Bowditch has a well written
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko1.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/yurko.htm
I wonder why this published piece was removed/withdrawn? Did you ever
find out why, peter?
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/buttram.htm

Your very own Peter Bowditch.
He is not an altie but goes out of his way to dismiss alternative and
back big pharma.
IOW Bowditch will go for mainstream explanations every time.

Then Carole or which ever sock she is pretending to be, try to
counter peter bowditch's article with facts and data.

This is a case where your usual empty hand waving and spin will not
cut it.

[Bob Officer]

On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England

Fallacy of Poison Well. citation of aj wakefield... all citations
discounted at that point.

[Enquiring minds want to know]

Post by Bob Officer
On Wed, 28 May 2014 15:00:31 +1000, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Clayton
http://vactruth.com/2014/03/19/tissue-scurvy-not-child-abuse/
Christina England

Fallacy of Poison Well. citation of aj wakefield... all citations
discounted at that point.

The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.


Enquiring minds want to know

The pharmaceutical industry is based on myths and lies
http://www.pharmamyths.net/

Institutional Corruption of Pharmaceuticals and the Myth of Safe and
Effective Drugs
http://www.pharmamyths.net/files/JLME_ARTICLE_2013.pdf

Big Pharma Pockets $711 Billion in Profits by Price-Gouging Taxpayers
and Seniors
http://healthcareforamericanow.org/2013/04/08/pharma-711-billion-profits-price-gouging-seniors/

Pharmaceutical Companies Spent 19 Times More On Self-Promotion Than
Basic Research: Report
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/pharmaceutical-companies-marketing_n_1760380.html

[george152]

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Yet you cannot prove him wrong

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.
Enquiring minds want to know

Carole, you are a kook, not an enquiring mind

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:48:25 +1200, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Yet you cannot prove him wrong

She has been challenged before to show exactly how the science is
faulty, but can't.

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.
Enquiring minds want to know

Carole, you are a kook, not an enquiring mind

Exactly.

Did you know carole has a silly belief that 'adding 2+2 and getting
an answer of 3 or 5 means a person is thinking outside the box'.

I looked as several different math theories and have yet to find one
that even hints that a correct answers for two+two is anything but
four.

[Enquiring minds want to know]

Post by Bob Officer
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:48:25 +1200, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Yet you cannot prove him wrong

She has been challenged before to show exactly how the science is
faulty, but can't.

The logic behind most of bowditch's ratbags website is blatantly
pro-mainstream / pharmaceutical medicine. Whatever mainstream
ridicules, that is what ratbags ridicules.

They are in sync. There is no difference.
So if you're interested in alternative medicine, you wouldn't want to
bother with the ratbags website as it is in sync with mainstream
medicine aka pharmaceutical medicine, which isn't scientific, it is
oriented towards making moey for big pharma.

Post by Bob Officer

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.
Enquiring minds want to know

Carole, you are a kook, not an enquiring mind

Exactly.
Did you know carole has a silly belief that 'adding 2+2 and getting
an answer of 3 or 5 means a person is thinking outside the box'.
I looked as several different math theories and have yet to find one
that even hints that a correct answers for two+two is anything but
four.

Did you know that bob by his own admission is a "tool .."
Its true ...but you won't find it most probably since he deletes his
posts - doesn't want to get caught out, you know how it is.



Enquiring minds want to know

The pharmaceutical industry is based on myths and lies
http://www.pharmamyths.net/

[Fred]

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Did you know that bob by his own admission is a "tool .."
Its true ...but you won't find it most probably since he deletes his
posts - doesn't want to get caught out, you know how it is.

That is not true.

You intentionally misquoted Bob.

And Bob did not delete that post. It remains in Google's
archives and shows your intentional misquote.

[Fred]

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Did you know that bob by his own admission is a "tool .."
Its true ...but you won't find it most probably since he deletes his
posts - doesn't want to get caught out, you know how it is.

That is not true.
You intentionally misquoted Bob.
And Bob did not delete that post. It remains in Google's
archives and shows your intentional misquote.

http://groups.google.com/group/misc.health.alternative/msg/5d01e417753b13df


From: Bob Officer <-*-****@.*-*->
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: Double blind randomised EBM scientific non-biased studies
in homeopathy
Date: Sun, 21 Nov 2010 11:19:45 -0800
Message-ID: <***@4ax.com>

On Sun, 21 Nov 2010 18:14:53 +1100, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
On Sun, 21 Nov 2010 09:34:29 +1100, in misc.health.alternative,

On Sat, 20 Nov 2010 07:29:46 +1100, in misc.health.alternative,

As a demonstration of carole's poor memory and to show she has done
nothing in her life but manage to decieve herself I will post the
important parts from the message header"

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

Once again bob proves "I am a tool ..."

I did not say that nor did I use the ellipses, Carole.
I said: "I am a tool user."

Bad memory.

Yours not mine. I can provide the message id where you mangled the
post, and after all I sure Peter can pull it off and repost it.
you do google is the only Newsserver which respects the XNA
header. Every other server respects the expire header.

I think you'll find its your memory that is at fault.

My Post she is quoting from:


From: Bob Officer <***@127.0.0.7>
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: America's mental illness epidemic: It turns out that jan
drew the problem
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2010 16:33:56 -0700
Message-ID: <***@4ax.com>

On Wed, 13 Oct 2010 18:14:41 +1100, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
On Sun, 10 Oct 2010 10:38:12 +1100, in misc.health.alternative,

On Sun, 10 Oct 2010 05:40:49 +1100, in misc.health.alternative,

On 09 Oct 2010 15:04:45 GMT, in misc.health.alternative,

On Fri, 8 Oct 2010 19:42:12 -0700 (PDT), in
misc.health.alternative,

{snip of about 450 lines}

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

See Carole you can't be consistent.

I take this back Carole, you have been consistent in "being shown to
be a idiot," usually by your own actions.

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

You can't even discuss the topic which is what the thread is
about without resorting to personal attacks.

I have, and Carole your constant failure to recognized the failures
of so called natural cures in the past, means sooner or later such
failures could be visited upon you.

Or you because you seem incapable of thinking for yourself and merely
resort to scientism and the status quo to support your stand.

Sorry I am a tool user, I don't use beliefs. A rational person uses
evidence, data and logic. I have learned to recognize hear-say and
other logical fallacies and avoid them for the pitfalls and traps
they are.

<snip Of signature>

</citation>

Now for the post in which Carole dishonestly snipped out the phase
which she is dishonestly using and there for each time she used it
she lied. Now she has start lying to herself.

How very typical of carole.

Now for Carole Post where she created this lie


<Cite>

From: "carole" <***@yahoo.com.au>
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative
Subject: Re: America's mental illness epidemic: It turns out that jan
drew the problem
Message-ID: <DfOto.42$***@viwinnwfe01.internal.bigpond.com>
Date: Fri, 15 Oct 2010 12:37:30 +1100
NNTP-Posting-Host: 124.190.236.1

Post by Fred
On Wed, 13 Oct 2010 18:14:41 +1100, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

On Sun, 10 Oct 2010 10:38:12 +1100, in misc.health.alternative,

On Sun, 10 Oct 2010 05:40:49 +1100, in

<snip of about 450 lines>

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

You can't even discuss the topic which is what the thread is
about without resorting to personal attacks.

I have, and Carole your constant failure to recognized the
failures of so called natural cures in the past, means sooner or
later such failures could be visited upon you.

Or you because you seem incapable of thinking for yourself and
merely resort to scientism and the status quo to support your
stand.

Sorry I am a tool

========== REMAINDER OF ARTICLE TRUNCATED ==========
--
From hubbca (carole hubbard)
Posted 12/9/2000 4:32 PM)

http://forum.lef.org/default.aspx?f=39&m=16385

</quote>

Years ago when my children were small they brought nits home
from school. I tried everything but they were persistant and
kept coming back. Then I read in an old book that nits were
scavengers and lived off the impurities in the blood. So I
figured if I could clean out the blood I'd get rid of them.
I tried fasting, distilled water, fruit diets and different
cell salts. Nothing worked. After consideration, I decided
to try some cell salts in higher concentrations. When I got
to calcium and after a few days, the nits starting disappearing.
I read in the Biochemic Handbook that Calcium Sulphate is a
blood purifier. They stayed away as long as I continued on
this high dose of calcium, when I lowered the dose they
starting coming back.

</end quote>

[Bob Officer]

On Fri, 30 May 2014 23:07:19 -0400, in misc.health.alternative, Fred

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Did you know that bob by his own admission is a "tool .."
Its true ...but you won't find it most probably since he deletes his
posts - doesn't want to get caught out, you know how it is.

That is not true.
You intentionally misquoted Bob.
And Bob did not delete that post. It remains in Google's
archives and shows your intentional misquote.

Good... carole believes creative editing isn't anything more than a
lie.

[george152]

Post by Fred

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Did you know that bob by his own admission is a "tool .."
Its true ...but you won't find it most probably since he deletes his
posts - doesn't want to get caught out, you know how it is.

That is not true.
You intentionally misquoted Bob.
And Bob did not delete that post. It remains in Google's
archives and shows your intentional misquote.

An antivaccinator lies ?
Shock horror..
You'd imagine by now that Carole would go away and find a quiet dark
corner to dribble in

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by Enquiring minds want to know

Post by Bob Officer
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:48:25 +1200, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Yet you cannot prove him wrong

She has been challenged before to show exactly how the science is
faulty, but can't.

The logic behind most of bowditch's ratbags website is blatantly
pro-mainstream / pharmaceutical medicine. Whatever mainstream
ridicules, that is what ratbags ridicules.

Please point to the pharma bias in the following articles:

http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/tjapaltjarri.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/ausscience1004_marymack.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/y7110823_creation.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/mlmarithmetic.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/coincidence.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/ausscience1403_phil.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/books/reviews/vs_sciencegod.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/ausscience1309_conspiracy.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/ausscience1310_religion.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/ausscience0907_aintso.htm
http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/mlmcompany.htm

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
They are in sync. There is no difference.
So if you're interested in alternative medicine, you wouldn't want to
bother with the ratbags website as it is in sync with mainstream
medicine aka pharmaceutical medicine, which isn't scientific, it is
oriented towards making moey for big pharma.

Post by Bob Officer

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.
Enquiring minds want to know

Carole, you are a kook, not an enquiring mind

Exactly.
Did you know carole has a silly belief that 'adding 2+2 and getting
an answer of 3 or 5 means a person is thinking outside the box'.
I looked as several different math theories and have yet to find one
that even hints that a correct answers for two+two is anything but
four.

Did you know that bob by his own admission is a "tool .."
Its true ...but you won't find it most probably since he deletes his
posts - doesn't want to get caught out, you know how it is.
Enquiring minds want to know
The pharmaceutical industry is based on myths and lies
http://www.pharmamyths.net/

[Bob Casanova]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:48:25 +1200, the following appeared

Post by george152

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Yet you cannot prove him wrong

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.
Enquiring minds want to know

Carole, you are a kook, not an enquiring mind

True, but to be fair (although the reason for doing so
escapes me at the moment) *some* vaccines *can* have side
effects on a very small percentage of the population. So
let's see, for example... smallpox eradicated vs.
detrimental side effects on perhaps 0.1% of those
vaccinated. Sure sounds like we should never have gone down
that road...NOT.

[george152]

Post by Bob Casanova
True, but to be fair (although the reason for doing so
escapes me at the moment) *some* vaccines *can* have side
effects on a very small percentage of the population. So
let's see, for example... smallpox eradicated vs.
detrimental side effects on perhaps 0.1% of those
vaccinated. Sure sounds like we should never have gone down
that road...NOT.

I was born before most of these vaccines were developed and saw to many
grieving families and far to many polio affected people.
Carole is a thing

[Fred]

Post by george152

True, but to be fair (although the reason for doing so escapes me
at the moment) *some* vaccines *can* have side effects on a very
small percentage of the population. So let's see, for example...
smallpox eradicated vs. detrimental side effects on perhaps 0.1% of
those vaccinated. Sure sounds like we should never have gone down
that road...NOT.

I was born before most of these vaccines were developed and saw to
many grieving families and far to many polio affected people. Carole
is a thing

Carole has issues.
--
From: "Carole" <***@iimetro.com.au>
Newsgroups: misc.health.alternative,alt.usenet.kooks
Subject: Re: HOMEOPATHY FACTS LIST - 45 FACTS
Message-ID: <jo_el.14373$***@news-server.bigpond.net.au>
Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2009 14:09:19 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 124.190.236.1

Post by george152
On Fri, 23 Jan 2009 12:11:43 GMT, in alt.usenet.kooks, "Carole"

<snip>

Post by george152

Bob Officer is against alternative medicine.

I am against ineffective treatments and irrational risks. Unlike
Carole, I am against [products] which have not been shown to be
effective treatments and have an unknown value and unassessed risk.

You wouldn't know an ineffective treatment if it jumped up and bit
you on the dick.

[Bob Officer]

On Sun, 01 Jun 2014 08:20:41 +1200, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by george152

Post by Bob Casanova
True, but to be fair (although the reason for doing so
escapes me at the moment) *some* vaccines *can* have side
effects on a very small percentage of the population. So
let's see, for example... smallpox eradicated vs.
detrimental side effects on perhaps 0.1% of those
vaccinated. Sure sounds like we should never have gone down
that road...NOT.

I was born before most of these vaccines were developed and saw to many
grieving families and far to many polio affected people.
Carole is a thing

One of my friends is a blind man. His blindness is due to a measles
infection. Measles is not harmless.

I know of four people that I grew up with that had polio and survived
into their 40s and 50s. Going through life using leg braces I guess
is not something many people have to do any more.

I few years ago the last person living in an iron lung in the US
died.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/24859306/ns/health-health_care/t/us-woman-dies-iron-lung-after-power-failure/

She didn't die from the polio but a power failure.

[Bob Casanova]

On Sun, 01 Jun 2014 08:20:41 +1200, the following appeared

Post by george152

Post by Bob Casanova
True, but to be fair (although the reason for doing so
escapes me at the moment) *some* vaccines *can* have side
effects on a very small percentage of the population. So
let's see, for example... smallpox eradicated vs.
detrimental side effects on perhaps 0.1% of those
vaccinated. Sure sounds like we should never have gone down
that road...NOT.

I was born before most of these vaccines were developed and saw to many
grieving families and far to many polio affected people.

Same here. And now that the loons are pushing their
anti-vaccination idiocy, polio should be making a comeback
in the US, spread from areas in which it's still endemic. We
can only hope that the smallpox samples stay locked up.

Post by george152
Carole is a thing

Succinct analysis... ;-)

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.

I'll go real slow here for the hard of thinking.

Nobody

denies

that

there

can

be

adverse

reactions

to

vaccines.

[For obvious reasons]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:30:57 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.

I'll go real slow here for the hard of thinking.
Nobody
denies
that
there
can
be
adverse
reactions
to
vaccines.

But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

What exactly about vaccines causes adverse reactions?

And if vaccines ARE actually safe and disease preventing, life
affirming, then it would be the only product that big pharma makes
that is safe and efficacious.

But due to the conning nature of big pharma, everything they say is up
for querying and scrutiny because they lie to make money.




For obvious reasons

How Pharmaceuticals Came To Be The 4th Leading Cause Of Death In
America
http://www.collective-evolution.com/2013/11/20/how-pharmaceuticals-came-to-be-the-4th-leading-cause-of-death-in-america/

The Laws of the Pharmaceutical Industry
http://www4.dr-rath-foundation.org/PHARMACEUTICAL_BUSINESS/laws_of_the_pharmaceutical_industry.htm
http://tinyurl.com/zgmi 


The History of the Pharma-Cartel
http://www4.dr-rath-foundation.org/THE_FOUNDATION/history_of_the_pharma_cartel.html


The Truth About the Rockefeller Drug Empire: The Drug Story
http://www.whale.to/b/ruesch.html

William D. Rockefeller - snake oil salesman
http://www.corbettreport.com/meet-william-rockefeller-snake-oil-salesman/

[george152]

Post by For obvious reasons
But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

How many sock puppets are we up to now ?

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 16:38:43 +1200, in misc.health.alternative,

Post by george152

Post by For obvious reasons
But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

How many sock puppets are we up to now ?

19 or 20.

[Lu]

Post by george152

Post by For obvious reasons
But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

How many sock puppets are we up to now ?

I think I have this right????

1. Clark
2. e. Peabody (Emily)
3. Reg Griswold
4. Sandy
5. Chenelle of Chenelle (Genelle)
6. Verna
7. Clayton
8. Jeffery
9. Duncan
10. Fred's Brain Fungus
11. Jurimed
12. Abumar
13. Enquiring minds want to know
14. For obvious reasons
15. Science psycho
16. The Sock
17. Thinkingman
18. Toomey


--
Lu

[george152]

Post by Lu

Post by george152

Post by For obvious reasons
But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

How many sock puppets are we up to now ?

I think I have this right????
1. Clark
2. e. Peabody (Emily)
3. Reg Griswold
4. Sandy
5. Chenelle of Chenelle (Genelle)
6. Verna
7. Clayton
8. Jeffery
9. Duncan
10. Fred's Brain Fungus
11. Jurimed
12. Abumar
13. Enquiring minds want to know
14. For obvious reasons
15. Science psycho
16. The Sock
17. Thinkingman
18. Toomey
--
Lu

Thanks

[Ernie]

Post by Lu

Post by george152

Post by For obvious reasons
But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

How many sock puppets are we up to now ?

I think I have this right????
1. Clark
2. e. Peabody (Emily)
3. Reg Griswold
4. Sandy
5. Chenelle of Chenelle (Genelle)
6. Verna
7. Clayton
8. Jeffery
9. Duncan
10. Fred's Brain Fungus
11. Jurimed
12. Abumar
13. Enquiring minds want to know
14. For obvious reasons
15. Science psycho
16. The Sock
17. Thinkingman
18. Toomey

Looks thorough and complete to me.
I can't find any others she may have used.
--
From: "carole" <***@yahoo.com.au>
Newsgroups: alt.support.cancer,misc.health.alternative,sci.med
Subject: Re: The Efficacy of Radiotherapy By Don Benjamin
Message-ID: <c6Edo.4655$***@viwinnwfe02.internal.bigpond.com>
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 10:59:21 +1000
NNTP-Posting-Host: 124.190.236.1

<snip>

And yes, I admit to having a mind closed tighter than a fishes arse.
If I was in an accident or got poisoned somehow, I admit I would put
my health in the hands of conventional medicine.
There are you happy, I've finally admitted it -- that they're good
for something.

I hope you're all happy.

[Bob Casanova]

On Sun, 01 Jun 2014 00:59:56 -0400, the following appeared

Post by Ernie

Post by Lu

Post by george152

Post by For obvious reasons
But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

How many sock puppets are we up to now ?

I think I have this right????
1. Clark
2. e. Peabody (Emily)
3. Reg Griswold
4. Sandy
5. Chenelle of Chenelle (Genelle)
6. Verna
7. Clayton
8. Jeffery
9. Duncan
10. Fred's Brain Fungus
11. Jurimed
12. Abumar
13. Enquiring minds want to know
14. For obvious reasons
15. Science psycho
16. The Sock
17. Thinkingman
18. Toomey

Looks thorough and complete to me.
I can't find any others she may have used.

Give her time; being "outed" can cause reflexive creation of
additional nyms.

[Lu]

Post by Bob Casanova
On Sun, 01 Jun 2014 00:59:56 -0400, the following appeared

Post by Ernie

Post by Lu

Post by george152

Post by For obvious reasons
But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

How many sock puppets are we up to now ?

I think I have this right????
1. Clark
2. e. Peabody (Emily)
3. Reg Griswold
4. Sandy
5. Chenelle of Chenelle (Genelle)
6. Verna
7. Clayton
8. Jeffery
9. Duncan
10. Fred's Brain Fungus
11. Jurimed
12. Abumar
13. Enquiring minds want to know
14. For obvious reasons
15. Science psycho
16. The Sock
17. Thinkingman
18. Toomey

Looks thorough and complete to me.
I can't find any others she may have used.

Give her time; being "outed" can cause reflexive creation of
additional nyms.

Yep! Expected!


--
Lu

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by For obvious reasons
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:30:57 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.

I'll go real slow here for the hard of thinking.
Nobody
denies
that
there
can
be
adverse
reactions
to
vaccines.

But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

Did I mention slow of thinking?

I had an accident at about 90-100kmh in my rally car. I suffered
extensive bruising from the seat belt (actually a four-point safety
harness). Are you suggesting that because seat belts can cause an
"adverse reaction" and are therefore not perfectly safe that their use
should be avoided?

Post by For obvious reasons
What exactly about vaccines causes adverse reactions?

All sorts of things. One is egg protein that might exist in traces in
flu vaccines. That is why the doctor always asks about egg allergy
before giving the shot.

Post by For obvious reasons
And if vaccines ARE actually safe and disease preventing, life
affirming, then it would be the only product that big pharma makes
that is safe and efficacious.

As almost everything made by pharmaceutical companies is efficacious
and those products which are not safe in certain circumstances are
treated with caution (I don't know how many times I've been asked if I
have ever had a reaction to any antibiotics), your statement makes no
sense.

Post by For obvious reasons
But due to the conning nature of big pharma, everything they say is up
for querying and scrutiny because they lie to make money.

<snip remaining repetitive bullshit>

[Bob Casanova]

On Sun, 01 Jun 2014 10:55:25 +1000, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by For obvious reasons
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:30:57 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.

I'll go real slow here for the hard of thinking.
Nobody
denies
that
there
can
be
adverse
reactions
to
vaccines.

But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

That may be the stupidest single question I've read in the
past week.

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch
Did I mention slow of thinking?

...for values of "slow" approaching "non-existent".

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch
I had an accident at about 90-100kmh in my rally car. I suffered
extensive bruising from the seat belt (actually a four-point safety
harness). Are you suggesting that because seat belts can cause an
"adverse reaction" and are therefore not perfectly safe that their use
should be avoided?

Post by For obvious reasons
What exactly about vaccines causes adverse reactions?

All sorts of things. One is egg protein that might exist in traces in
flu vaccines. That is why the doctor always asks about egg allergy
before giving the shot.

Post by For obvious reasons
And if vaccines ARE actually safe and disease preventing, life
affirming, then it would be the only product that big pharma makes
that is safe and efficacious.

As almost everything made by pharmaceutical companies is efficacious
and those products which are not safe in certain circumstances are
treated with caution (I don't know how many times I've been asked if I
have ever had a reaction to any antibiotics), your statement makes no
sense.

Post by For obvious reasons
But due to the conning nature of big pharma, everything they say is up
for querying and scrutiny because they lie to make money.

<snip remaining repetitive bullshit>

[For obvious reasons]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:30:57 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.

I'll go real slow here for the hard of thinking.
Nobody
denies
that
there
can
be
adverse
reactions
to
vaccines.

But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?

What exactly about vaccines causes adverse reactions?

And if vaccines ARE actually safe and disease preventing, life
affirming, then it would be the only product that big pharma makes
that is safe and efficacious.

But due to the conning nature of big pharma, everything they say is up
for querying and scrutiny because they lie to make money.




For obvious reasons

How Pharmaceuticals Came To Be The 4th Leading Cause Of Death In
America
http://www.collective-evolution.com/2013/11/20/how-pharmaceuticals-came-to-be-the-4th-leading-cause-of-death-in-america/

The Laws of the Pharmaceutical Industry
http://www4.dr-rath-foundation.org/PHARMACEUTICAL_BUSINESS/laws_of_the_pharmaceutical_industry.htm
http://tinyurl.com/zgmi 


The History of the Pharma-Cartel
http://www4.dr-rath-foundation.org/THE_FOUNDATION/history_of_the_pharma_cartel.html


The Truth About the Rockefeller Drug Empire: The Drug Story
http://www.whale.to/b/ruesch.html

William D. Rockefeller - snake oil salesman
http://www.corbettreport.com/meet-william-rockefeller-snake-oil-salesman/

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by For obvious reasons
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:30:57 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
There does appear to be some adverse effects from vaccinations and to
deny it makes the pro vaccers liars and idiots.

I'll go real slow here for the hard of thinking.
Nobody
denies
that
there
can
be
adverse
reactions
to
vaccines.

But if the vaccines and safe how could there possibly be adverse
reactions?
What exactly about vaccines causes adverse reactions?
And if vaccines ARE actually safe and disease preventing, life
affirming, then it would be the only product that big pharma makes
that is safe and efficacious.
But due to the conning nature of big pharma, everything they say is up
for querying and scrutiny because they lie to make money.

Did you really have to use two different socks for this, Carole?

<snip bullshit>

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Thank you for the testimonial, Carole. I will have a t-shirt printed
with this message on it.

[Enquiring minds want to know]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:31:37 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Thank you for the testimonial, Carole. I will have a t-shirt printed
with this message on it.

While you're about it Randall, you should have another t-shirt printed
with "back-to-front, upside-down man" printed on it.


Enquiring minds want to know

The pharmaceutical industry is based on myths and lies
http://www.pharmamyths.net/

Institutional Corruption of Pharmaceuticals and the Myth of Safe and
Effective Drugs
http://www.pharmamyths.net/files/JLME_ARTICLE_2013.pdf

[Poor Peter Bowditch]

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:31:37 +1000, Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Thank you for the testimonial, Carole. I will have a t-shirt printed
with this message on it.

While you're about it Randall, you should have another t-shirt printed
with "back-to-front, upside-down man" printed on it.

I went to an exhibition of pole dancing last night. There were lots of
"back-to-front, upside-down" ladies there. (One of them was my
daughter.)

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
Enquiring minds want to know
The pharmaceutical industry is based on myths and lies
http://www.pharmamyths.net/
Institutional Corruption of Pharmaceuticals and the Myth of Safe and
Effective Drugs
http://www.pharmamyths.net/files/JLME_ARTICLE_2013.pdf

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:31:37 +1000, in misc.health.alternative, Poor

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Thank you for the testimonial, Carole. I will have a t-shirt printed
with this message on it.

Make sure you have it done at a place which will ship to the US.

I have invited her to show exactly how and exactly why the "science"
is "faulty". She needs to fully explain her reasoning.

I have asked her several times why she stated her belief adding 2+2
and getting some answer other than 4 could mean anything but a wrong
answer. I have never received a reply.

[Duncan]

Post by Bob Officer
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:31:37 +1000, in misc.health.alternative, Poor

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Thank you for the testimonial, Carole. I will have a t-shirt printed
with this message on it.

Make sure you have it done at a place which will ship to the US.
I have invited her to show exactly how and exactly why the "science"
is "faulty". She needs to fully explain her reasoning.

Tim was right, bob officer is a nym for peter bowditch.

Post by Bob Officer
I have asked her several times why she stated her belief adding 2+2
and getting some answer other than 4 could mean anything but a wrong
answer. I have never received a reply.

Duncan

">I didn't know there was a requirement to generate topics. Where did

Post by Bob Officer
you get that idiotic idea from. " -- Bob Officer

[Ernie]

Post by Duncan
Tim was right, bob officer is a nym for peter bowditch.

Patrick Timothy Bolen was never correct.

Add that he's a tax cheat.

Apart from that, he wants nothing to do with an idiot like you, carole.
Neither did jan. And that's the reason they no longer post here.
--
From: "carole" <***@yahoo.com.au>
Newsgroups: alt.support.cancer,misc.health.alternative,sci.med
Subject: Re: The Efficacy of Radiotherapy By Don Benjamin
Message-ID: <c6Edo.4655$***@viwinnwfe02.internal.bigpond.com>
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2010 10:59:21 +1000
NNTP-Posting-Host: 124.190.236.1

<snip>

And yes, I admit to having a mind closed tighter than a fishes arse.
If I was in an accident or got poisoned somehow, I admit I would put
my health in the hands of conventional medicine.
There are you happy, I've finally admitted it -- that they're good
for something.

I hope you're all happy.

[Bob Casanova]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:31:37 +1000, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Thank you for the testimonial, Carole. I will have a t-shirt printed
with this message on it.

She'll probably never understand that such a comment as
hers, by a loon such as her, is a mark of honor.

[Bob Officer]

On Sat, 31 May 2014 10:04:11 -0700, in misc.health.alternative, Bob

Post by Bob Casanova
On Sat, 31 May 2014 09:31:37 +1000, the following appeared
in sci.skeptic, posted by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Poor Peter Bowditch

Post by Enquiring minds want to know
The mere fact that something appears on the bowditch website, shows
that it is based on faulty science combined with fiction.

Thank you for the testimonial, Carole. I will have a t-shirt printed
with this message on it.

She'll probably never understand that such a comment as
hers, by a loon such as her, is a mark of honor.

Cafe press?

Market T-shirts, coffee mugs, mouse pads